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Author Topic: Zero Carb Interview  (Read 18353 times)

Jan in Key West

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Zero Carb Interview
« on: March 18, 2015, 08:39:45 AM »
Sharing an interview (one of several) posted on a zero-carb FB group last week.....comments are worth a read as well.


https://eatmeatdrinkwater.wordpress.com/2015/03/09/zero-carb-interview-the-andersen-family/

deanna in AR

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2015, 06:01:37 AM »
Very different perspective! We figured out quickly that if we did this, DH would be doing all the cooking...and grocery shopping would only be for paper products and spring water. Works for me!

Lynda (Fl)

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2015, 09:23:42 AM »
An impressive story. Thanks, Jan. I often wondered if anyone was doing an all meat diet, just to lazy to research it myself.  It sure would make shopping and cooking easier. I did once for a week and a half, just because my stomach hurt with everything but meat, avocado an eggs.  It helped a lot.

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2015, 12:21:08 PM »
How much simpler our lives would be if the only  thing we ate was steak!  Nearly all of our kitchen cabinets would be empty.  Pantries too.  Like Deanna posted, we would go to the store for paper goods, cleansers and our meat.  Without buying all the rest of the stuff, or maintaining so much equipment, we would probably save money as well.

deanna in AR

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2015, 01:35:05 PM »
Jan, I think I remember that you mentioned previously that y'all were not eating many veggies. Is that correct?

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2015, 08:54:20 AM »
Yes, Deanna, I eat very few veggies and on some days I eat none at all. Unfortunately, I still need to provide some for my husband (who is semi-resistant to going lower). The one thing I've noticed is increased stamina on the pickle ball court, which I started playing several times a week this year. I can go for two to three hours at a time and I'm not worn out.


Would love to see some research into the gut biome of a zero carber......if I find anything, I'll be sure to post.

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2015, 02:44:48 PM »
I did run across an interview with Eric Westman on low carb, health and the microbiome that reinforces my suspicions that different gut biomes may be required for different diets.....there is no 'one size fits all'.......and perhaps why if eating >50 net carbs per day (especially plant carbs) would require RS consumption.


"But it is equally plausible that when you eliminate (dietary) plants and all the micro biome that's good at eating plants and turning them into fats and other things, that we'll be just fine and we'll have a micro biome that's adapted to mainly eating meat."


http://www.meandmydiabetes.com/2014/11/17/eric-westman-md-carb-health-microbiome/

BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2015, 03:07:12 PM »
Amazingly good looking family!  And very interesting story.  I don't know if I ever mentioned that I ate zero carb for a number of years, back around 2003 and on.  It's amazing for weight loss, but I missed salads and "cooking" after a while.  But in between, I would eat in the style of "The Bear" and truly enjoyed that way of eating.  So easy!  I guess you can't get more Keto than that.  Not sure why I stopped … but there was a move, some surgery, change of life situations, I guess I let myself fall of the wagon too easily. There will be a new wind blowing soon though, keep the motivating articles coming!!  8) ;D

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2015, 08:57:29 AM »
This morning, Dr. Davis re-posted the Andersen zero carb interview (link above) on his FB page. Now that should inspire some lively conversation.....not to mention a surge of newbies to ZIOH.

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2015, 04:35:04 PM »
Jan,

My production of stomach acid is low.  I had crippling acid reflux for many years.  Due to our WOE and many supplements, my digestion is about 95% better.
Perhaps it is just me, but every time I try to go to zero carbs, the acid reflux comes back.  When I eat a meal of half veggies and half animal proteins, I am fine.  Sometimes I need to take 1 HCL with Pepsin (650 mg) but mostly don't need that.  When I eat mostly or all animal proteins, I need to supplement with 3 or 4 HCL pills to help digest the food. 

I haven't read anything about this phenomenon at all.  My thinking is that vegetables are mainly alkaline and require less acid to digest while animal products require more acid to digest properly.  If your stomach acid is low, then a meal with animal proteins and fats needs the added acid from supplements.
Have you come across any information about this situation?

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2015, 05:07:04 AM »
Barbara,
In a cursory look into the causes of low stomach acid, the list includes: stress, candida, prior anti-acid usage, age, B deficiency, carb intake....SAD is (most likely) largely responsible for the increase in this phenomenon, not to mention the other toxins we typically ingest. Interesting thing is that normally, protein and fats (which IMHO our bodies were designed to easily digest) stimulate stomach acid production.....but that might not be the case (as you found out) in those with existing low acid production. Interestingly, this very question was presented to ZC this morning with regard to someone's husband so if any new information is presented by the veterans, I'll pass it on. But you need to honor you body and do what feels the best for you.


Just as there are adaptation phases transitioning from SAD to WB, there are adaptation phases transitioning from VLCHF to ZC....most of which are uncomfortable. I hear many of the same stories there as I read here. What interests me, is that a large number of ZC ppl were eating VLC (no wheat/grains/sugar) and still having a vast number of health and weight issues.....once they went zero, most maladies subsided. And most have been maintaining this for several years.


Didn't mean to hijack the integrity of this forum which is dedicated to supporting those transitioning to WB....a vital step toward healthy living. Sorry Rita!

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2015, 07:46:52 AM »
Thanks Jan.

In my opinion, ZC is a phase of WB and VLCHF way of eating.  It seems to work better than other menus for some people after they have begun to regain their health and lost the inflammation caused by grains and sugars.  I wonder what the common denominator is? 

To respond to your questioning why there are so many unresolved health and weight issues even with a no grains/sugar diet, my guess is that it just takes a long long time to really change your bodily functions.  Both Maria Emmerich and Dr. Davis have stated that it can take 6 weeks or so to actually have your cells recover from a "wheat cheat".  Keeping your liver in a fat burning mode depends on its health as an organ and whether or not you are drinking alcohol as well as eating grains and sugar.  It can take weeks for your liver just to clear out the sugars stored in your body. 

We just don't give our bodies enough time to recoup from all those years of eating compromised items advertised as food.  In my opinion, based on your age and health, it can take years to actually normalize your intestines and gut biomes.  Once various blood tests show that inflammation has diminished to normal levels, then the actual healing begins in all areas.  When thyroid to stomach acid to insulin/cortisol production and all the other hormones and amino acids, etc.  really normalize their production, you begin to see the enormous resolution of actual diseases. 

In short, I think we just haven't given our body enough time to right itself. 

jgilberAZ

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2015, 07:46:43 AM »
This has gotten me back on track, again.

After reading the link in the first post, I realized that the low carb portion of LCHF was still producing carb cravings, resulting in occasional "cheats" and infrequent "totally blown it" days.

Since reading the initial post, and the interview, and a whole lot of other interviews, and joining the zero carb the easy way Facebook page, I've tried to eat a "no plant food" diet.

The carb cravings are gone, and the lengthy plateau has broken … I'm losing weight, again.

Happy days.

You can see the graph of my initial weight loss, and the lengthy plateau, here:

http://jeffgilbertson.wordpress.com/LCHF

BTW, I'm eating more than "just meat." I am just avoiding anything that comes from a plant.  And, I'm drinking more than "just water." But, only water, coffee, and tea.
Low Carb Since April 2009.

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2015, 08:08:16 AM »
Jeff,
You're right, zero carb isn't an accurate description....it's zero plant carbs. Zero carbers don't count the carbs from the animal kingdom which is what always messed me up.....I counted seafood carbs, eggs, cheese etc.


It's been a natural progression for me.....I began noticing that I was pushing the veggies around on my plate and didn't really have any desire to eat them. When I'm hungry, I tend to want meat. I've checked my BG, there has been no change.






Rita

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2015, 10:47:36 AM »
I don't think I could do it.  I personally believe phytonutrients are important, and I believe we need plants for a healthy gut biome. 
http://humanfoodproject.com/sorry-low-carbers-your-microbiome-is-just-not-that-into-you/

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2015, 12:15:57 PM »
To add to this discussion:

Seems to me that many of the health issues we face today are caused by the nutritionally deficient plant products and those which have been genetically changed for taste and other reasons as well as inappropriate portions of carbohydrates to everything else we eat. The soil additives and pesticides are good for a quick and increased yield, but ruins the soil.  The depleted soil requires more and more additives and water since it doesn't retain as much as it used to and dries out quickly.  Many books have been written on this subject: Jared Diamond's "Collapse" for example.  Civilizations have floundered when they wasted their natural resources. 

Throughout history, humans have used plants for medicinal purposes, to flavor their food and for meals, learning to pound, squash, store, ferment and cook it for what ever its purpose was.  Every culture had a different way to do this.  Shamans were revered and passed along their knowledge of edibles and medicinals.  When grains were added to the diet on a frequent basis,  tooth decay started.  Today, blueberries, lemons, grapefruit and all the other fruits are all very far removed from their original forms.  The genetic changes and pesticides/chemical fertilizers have produced a fruit that is extraordinarily high in fructose, not the way nature intended.  You wonder what other phytonutrients have been eliminated or are out of balance.  Same idea for our vegetables which contain few of the nutrients we need to stay healthy.  Even our polluted water doesn't contain the nutrients we need.

Perhaps the reason some people are feeling better on this very low carb/zero carb way of eating is because they are really reacting to the GMO, pesticide/chemical fertilized vegetables and fruits.  Once these toxins have been removed from their diet, then they begin to feel better.

A good test of this would be for those trying to eat in a zero carb manner to actually start a small kitchen garden and grow your own produce using heirloom seeds and healthy soil.  What you grow would be suitable to your weather.   Then you assess how you feel.

While many people don't believe that we are on the verge of an ecological collapse and that our health problems are not related to our contrived, unnatural diets, Monsanto and Friends are eagerly supplying their "scientific know how" to solve the problems they created, all in the name of corporate profits.  I'm old enough to remember when white grapefruits had a sweet/sour, tart taste.  You can't find them anywhere.  I just wonder what nutrients they used to contain and how they contributed to a healthy gut biome.

I think another fair test of a zero carb diet would be to do before and after nutritional blood tests, especially for nutrients contained in our tissues.  Perhaps a 6 month time period.

ldyrdr4311

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2015, 03:59:07 PM »
Good points, Barb

Rita

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2015, 09:15:43 PM »
Yes… good point Barb.  And speaking of depleted soils, did you read this article:


How Does Flavor Drive Nutrition?
http://www.wsj.com/articles/how-flavor-drives-nutrition-1428596326









Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2015, 05:49:25 AM »
Exactly right!  Good article.

Spices used to enhance the wonderful flavors of the food we ate.  First layer of spices used to be salt and pepper, followed by a sprinkling of "whatever" usually based on ethnic, cultural, regional and seasonal tastes.  Beef used to have a "beefy" flavor and didn't need to be smothered in a steak or other sweet sauce or marinated to have flavor. 

The spice trade is ancient and these exotic flavors became part of our lives as much as we could afford them.  Those spices were pungent and had more flavor and nutrients than those available today.  My guess is that today's spices are grown in equally depleted soil and sprayed with pesticides/fungicides.   Good case for organic purchases, although every imported spice must be sprayed before entering this country.

In this country, diners and fine restaurants used to be home cooking made with local, fresh ingredients.  This was before all those mixes became commercially available.  Now most of the food you purchase is processed to the point of the spices are the flavor you taste rather than the food item itself.  The food chemists know exactly what chemicals to combine and utilize  to keep you coming back for more of their product.


Once you break the habit of processed food, you really start tasting the peas and carrots, beef and chicken without drowning them in spices and sauces to have any taste.  Of course, the properly grown, raised and fed foodstuffs taste the best.  That is why we spend extra money on grass fed, organic, pastured and locally produced fresh food. 

Most amazing is that our health is improving and we don't have cravings.  This ALL starts with giving up wheat,,,,,

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2015, 05:54:44 AM »
Several people from the zero carb FB group are volunteering for the American Gut Project to have their gut biome analyzed.....hoping the Andersens join too! Will keep you posted on results....should be fascinating! The member with the shortest timeline is 5 1/2 years of this eating strategy.

Rita

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2015, 09:27:02 AM »
Very cool!  Please do post once they have results.

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #21 on: May 12, 2015, 02:12:49 PM »
An update on the Andersens.....Joe and Charlene posted this morning that since the above article was posted on the ZC FB page back in March, (and gone viral on social media), they have been approached by mainstream media ( both national and international) for interviews etc. which they have politely declined. Since the original interview (above), along with an outpouring of support and gratitude, they have received an equal number of threats and harassment. At this point, their priority is keeping their family safe and out of the line of fire.


This isn't about Big Food or Big Pharma.....this is about how the average person reacts when their dietary strategies are threatened. We often see the same anger in regards to WB everyday.

BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #22 on: May 12, 2015, 02:39:52 PM »
Incredible and outrageous!  Can't relate to harassing someone because of their dietary choices?


Anyway, have been reading all day, and came across this - just as outrageous and almost unbelievable!!


http://www.primalbody-primalmind.com/blog/


I am cringing at the idea of giving grandson that Earth's Best formula on occasion.  At least if wasn't his sole nourishment when little, we only started around 6 months, to allow easier supplemental feeding. I did try bone broth and liver pate, but he did not eat it. 






deanna in AR

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #23 on: May 12, 2015, 04:13:35 PM »
Barb, do you have an awesome recipe for liver pate? I'm thinking it might be a welcome addition in DH's lunch box. And, who knows, I might learn to like it!

BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #24 on: May 12, 2015, 04:23:25 PM »
Deanna, I just came across this one for the baby food, which actually sounds quite good and healthy.  I used to make it years ago, and will have to check online for something that sounds good, it's been a long while since I made it for "grown ups".


But this here sounds quite good and is basically what I made for grandson.  http://www.bubbayumyum.com/recipes/willows-pate/


I would sautee some shallots in butter, add cut up liver (chicken, beef, pork if you can find it - has best taste) and sautee lightly.  Add salt after finished cooking, pepper, sage, marjoram, anything you like and put into blender or Ninja, making it as finely ground as you like.  This I think would taste quite good.


I also love just plain sautéed liver with onions, yum … this is making me want to eat more liver!


 ;)




Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #25 on: May 12, 2015, 05:43:17 PM »
Forgot to mention that in conversing with the Andersens, found out they live (in the summer months) on a lake 20 minutes away from the lake I live on during the summer. Small world! We're going to get together this summer!

deanna in AR

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #26 on: May 13, 2015, 11:03:33 AM »
Barb, I think I'll try the one in your link. Thanks!

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #27 on: May 13, 2015, 11:41:18 AM »
Hi Deanna,


I will make chicken liver pate.  I posted a recipe from Zabar's Deli (NYC) on this forum some time ago.  For a liverwurst, I like to use Shaller & Weber's products.  It is made with pork livers from pastured pork raised humanely in Vermont..  If you go to their web site, you can locate a local vendor.  It is very mild tasting and they make several varieties.  This is another famous NYC firm, famous enough to sell all over the US.  IT costs the same as the supermarket brands that hang in refrigerated shelves near the bologna. 


Whole Foods started carrying a liverwurst from local suppliers.  I didn't like the mouthfeel nor the taste. 




BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #28 on: May 15, 2015, 08:56:57 AM »
Barbara,  I remember our conversation about Schaller and Weber, back when I first joined.  You might remember my MIL had a Deli next door to them, and they made all the salads that the store on 2nd Avenue sold.   8)


I can get the S&W liverwurst at Fresh Market here in NC, and I do buy it sometimes and enjoy greatly on the rolls I make with the psyllium husk powder.  Tastes almost like rye bread, that was always my favorite combination.


The wurst they export has more salt in it than the one I bought in NY.  And the sodium sometimes is too much for me, but the taste is excellent, and not one I've been able to copy so far.  I do know the son, Ralph Schaller, and could contact him for the recipe - think he would share it with us??  Haha … not likely!!   ;D

Lynda (Fl)

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2015, 09:53:12 AM »
Wow, Jan, what a wonderful opportunity.  I can see you and the Anderson's becoming good friends.  And really, what a small world.

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #30 on: May 15, 2015, 03:10:57 PM »
BarbinNC,


I no longer have a problem with salt since I started this WOE.  In fact, I use Himalayan or RealSalt (mined in Utah) rather liberally now and always use Malden Finishing Salt on my meats just prior to serving them.  Sometimes the S&W liver wursts do make me thirsty, but usually the taste is not overly salty.  I've had a few packages that seemed to be saltier than others, so maybe they weren't mixed well enough.  Compared to the usual CAFO brands, it contains much less salt. 

My problem would be finding the pork livers from pastured pork.  In fact, I can't find pastured pork locally at all.  I don't eat much pork and I don't miss it.  I'm sure this will change.  The pork I do purchase comes from The Fresh Market.  Ever since the Chinese purchased Smithfield Farms, they have been the low cost leader in pork products around here.  And we know that they can raise their pigs in horrid conditions, feeding them anything to gain weight and still sell it at a profit.  I feel sorry for the poor animals and sorrier for me because I wouldn't be getting much in the way of nutrition.  I have to thank this forum for enlightening me!



BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2015, 08:24:19 AM »
Hi Barbara,


thanks for the info, I do actually use Celtic Sea salt and have the pink stuff too, and use it exclusively in cooking, and don't seem to have a problem with them either - I think I was talking about more the commercial products that have salt in them, seem to cause me bloating, like the tops of my feet retain water and get puffy, if I have too much sausage, salami, cheese etc.  So that's were I was coming from with my comment, but you are right, salt is not the evil it's made out to be, as long as it's a nutritionally sound one.


And I totally agree with you about pork!  I also hate the fact that we now are at the mercy of the Chinese to procure the pork from wherever they choose.  Here in NC/SC we have a lot of pig farmers, and they are not pastured.  But as soon as I have a bit of free time, I will be searching for some, as I'm sure they exist here.  Just have to find them!

Lynda (Fl)

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2015, 10:20:52 AM »
Here again, I recommend getting your blood tested.  Sodium is a simple one.  My dr nags all the time about sodium and potassium .  My blood tests came back flagged for low sodium and potassium that was just fine.  I thought I was putting a decent amount of salt on my food but this WOE must have really lowered it.  I do sweat a lot gardening in the heat, which might explain the occasional light cramp. Since I removed packaged food, I am forced to add a lot more salt to my dishes and I eat sausage, etc, all the time.  I was almost shocked at how low it was, so if you have any doubts, get the test.  It's fairly cheap and will answer your questions about your salt intake.

Barbara from New Jersey

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #33 on: May 16, 2015, 12:39:52 PM »
Lynda,


The himalayan salt and RealSalt brand (from Utah) will be better absorbed by your body and normalize your blood levels.  I don't have any references to list, but I have read this many times.  I rarely salted anything much because I often cooked for my parents and their doctors insisted on a low salt diet.  I would use spices for flavor.  I got used to this way of eating many years ago. 


Whenever I ate something really salty, by ankles and feet would swell.  I just thought it was "salt sensitive" and would carefully avoid those foods.  Now I can salt my food to taste and don't have the swelling or great thirst afterwards.  These salts cost a bit more upfront, but last a very long time.  They really add to flavor and have never caused my ankles or feet to swell.  Even Dr. Davis recommends using these salts because we do need salt in our diets and don't get much when we aren't consuming processed/packaged foods.

Bob Niland (Boundless)

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #34 on: May 16, 2015, 02:43:05 PM »
re: ... himalayan salt and RealSalt brand (from Utah) will be better absorbed by your body ...

From my perspective, a credible quality Himalayan or RealSalt, as coarse crystals, served from your own grinder, is the way to go. They:
  • avoid or minimize anti-caking agents (which are necessary for fine/shaker salt, and could be modern aluminum compounds),
  • avoid salt refining residues,
  • avoid modern sea water pollutants, and;
  • provide trace minerals at approximately ancestral concentrations.
The challenge with Himalayan is assurance of origin and quality. With RS, be aware that most of their products are not coarse.

Neither will have added iodide, of course, but salt isn't a reliable way to get your iodine anyway.

All salt is sea salt, by the way (even refined salt). The questions are:
? how long ago was the water removed
? how was the water removed
? was anything else removed
? was anything added

All of which raises the never-answered question of what salt is used in any processed food you still take a chance on ...

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #35 on: May 18, 2015, 04:18:13 AM »
At Joe's request, the original interview his family did with Esmee' has been deleted. Although many found it inspiring, others found it menacing enough to send intimidating mail, threatening to engage children's services etc. I wish them well and am grateful that they offered us a different dietary perspective....even for a short while. Obviously, righteous zealotry isn't confined to religion.

BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #36 on: May 18, 2015, 06:00:24 AM »
That is truly sad, very very sad ….  ::)

Lynda (Fl)

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #37 on: May 18, 2015, 08:26:11 AM »
 >Obviously, righteous zealotry isn't confined to religion.<


So sadly (and scarily) true, Jan.  I'm sorry to hear they took the interview off but those readers are way too frightening to trust around the kids.  I found it fascinating.


Jan in Key West

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BarbinNC

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #39 on: May 24, 2015, 06:35:24 AM »
Jan, so they decided to put the interview back?  I hope all is ok with them and they are safe from the nuttos.




Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #40 on: May 24, 2015, 08:21:07 AM »
Unfortunately, Deanna, when something is posted on the internet, it has a life all of its' own.....a friend sent this and thought I'd leave it up for awhile so people could read it on this friendly forum.

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #41 on: May 31, 2015, 06:21:34 PM »
Here's Andrew's zero carb interview......he's my FB buddy from England.....BTW, he's doing the American Gut Project too!


http://zerocarbzen.com/2015/05/31/healing-brain-cancer-with-a-zero-carb-ketogenic-diet-by-andrew-scarborough/

Jan in Key West

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #42 on: June 01, 2015, 06:28:51 AM »
I'm in a closed FB group of ZCarbers......last night Michael Eades asked to join! Now this should be interesting!

deanna in AR

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #43 on: June 01, 2015, 08:09:28 AM »
Wow Jan! I read Andrew's zero carb interview...then I started reading the other ZC testimonials. Amazing! Not sure if this will lead anywhere for me or not...I'm really not much of a beef eater. I don't make bone broth. I don't eat organ meat. And then there's the wine. Part of the attraction for me is the ease of food shopping and prep. Sounds very interesting. I don't know if you could go there gradually or not...but you did, didn't you?


The other thing I've been wondering about lately is how to keep your body from being too acid. I think mine is already. I've been drinking a spoonful of baking soda with approximately 8 ounces of water every night, and I can tell a difference. I'm sleeping better too. Don't know where this is leading either.


Just thinking out loud...

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Re: Zero Carb Interview
« Reply #43 on: June 01, 2015, 08:09:28 AM »

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